Replacing dispositions

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vonpenguin
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Replacing dispositions

Post by vonpenguin » Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:03 am

So I'm making a number of houserules, and one big thing I would like to change is the way dispositions work. There are a lot of things that don't make a great deal of sense to me, such as the fact that by the rules as written, the blanket bonus and penalties to persuasion and deception, it is technically easier to threaten someone you love with bodily harm than a hated enemy. I was thinking about having "mindsets", thinks like suspicious or jovial, that would set your defenses against various things. And then "demeanor" like "business-like, and "smitten" that would give bonus' and penalties to certain techniques. I'm also adding a penalty for using the same technique three or more times in a row so I think this would alter a minor problem I see of "I use my highest attack" "I use my highest attack" rinse repeat.

Now the complexity isn't a huge issue. My player group tends to not mind this especially since we use maptools frameworks to help with things, but I'd like advice on balance and making the actual options.

omegonthesane
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Re: Replacing dispositions

Post by omegonthesane » Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:11 am

In terms of high concept this seems to make sense - technically you could come up with less ridiculous examples as ways to Intimidate loved ones, but let us please not GO there, and in any case they Dislike you afterwards.

So, for example, my Charm Specialist with Cruel Insanity would have a Suspicious mindset towards everyone if trying to replicate her actual behaviour - I always had her start Intrigues at Dislike, between only having 9 Composure and the fact that she knew she was a treacherous psychopath and also that she couldn't read people very well, so had to assume that other people might be as bad as her. However, having successfully won over her honour-bound cousin she'd probably be at least Amiable in demeanour towards said cousin, due to being able to trust her.

Got any numbers?

vonpenguin
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Re: Replacing dispositions

Post by vonpenguin » Wed Apr 23, 2014 3:28 am

I am mostly going for a bit more granularity and customizability overall. I was thinking something along the lines of weapons as base to work from, granting a 1 or 2 to or against certain things but then add a penalty to others. so someone that is acting secretive and trying to sell you your enemies secrets would have a bonus to bargin and incite type actions but not charm since this guy is clearly not your friend. I was thinking Mindset and demeanor could be changed with a will roll between exchanges, I was considering as an action but that seemed overly harsh.

Zorbeltuss
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Re: Replacing dispositions

Post by Zorbeltuss » Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:13 pm

There's the thing that you cannot make rules for everything. You are not going to intimidate someone you are of affectionate disposition towards because if you did, you wouldn't be affectionate towards them.

As for people using their treasured technique over and over..I have a different perspective:
You pick your tactic at the start of the intrigue, and then I am making you stick to it, and winning gives you the expected results for using that technique. You can charm people into liking you, yes, but if you wanted them to see your side of an issue, convince would have been a lot more effective. Basically, the technique used is the one that corresponds to the desired outcome.

vonpenguin
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Re: Replacing dispositions

Post by vonpenguin » Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:45 pm

That was mostly an example. But it should also, for example, not be harder to taunt someone that already hates you.

The biggest issue I am trying to address is that as impressive as the intrigue system is compared to other systems ti still feels lacking next to the combat system. It hits this weird spot were it certainly isn't rules light but doesn't feel as well loved as murder.

I wouldn't do that because using the same technique over and over would annoy people or clue them in to exactly what you're after. Especially with an intrigue on a scale that might take days or weeks. For a short term locking in one might work but then you might as well do a simple one roll test and be done with it?

omegonthesane
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Re: Replacing dispositions

Post by omegonthesane » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:03 pm

Zorbeltuss wrote:There's the thing that you cannot make rules for everything. You are not going to intimidate someone you are of affectionate disposition towards because if you did, you wouldn't be affectionate towards them.
Having seen parents interact with their children, I have to disagree.
Zorbeltuss wrote:As for people using their treasured technique over and over..I have a different perspective:
You pick your tactic at the start of the intrigue, and then I am making you stick to it, and winning gives you the expected results for using that technique. You can charm people into liking you, yes, but if you wanted them to see your side of an issue, convince would have been a lot more effective. Basically, the technique used is the one that corresponds to the desired outcome.
This rewards the largely-a-joke Convince-only Intrigue statline I proposed a while ago, and punishes all other approaches by comparison. If I'm forced to stick to only one approach for the whole intrigue, "Make person think that my way is best for them by appealing to their motivations" is the most broadly applicable and the one that requires the most bullshit to be inappropriate ("The guy is really angry and refuses to hear your argument! No, you can't follow his emotional motives to a logical-sounding conclusion in order to make him think that what you want him to do will get him what he wants and satisfy his emotional desires!")

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