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Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

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  • Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

    Has anyone statted up Palladiums's Nightbane/Nightspawn game? It should be easy to do, but I didn't want to reinvent the wheel if someone else had already done the math. Main question would be what level they would be. After that it would just be writing up the powers, I think.

  • #2
    Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

    The various Palladium systems were what I cut my teeth on when i first started playing RPGs as a kid, but I've never tried to convert Nightbane to M&M before. I don't have many Palladium books left in my collection anymore. I still have some Rifts books, a few Palladium fantasy books, and a couple from TMNT and After the Bomb. As I learned more systems, I still use Palladium settings for inspiration, but haven't actually used their mechanics in a game in years. They were great at world building, but their mechanics system needed a severe overhaul years ago.
    Classic car restoring, gun owning, martial arts practicing, military, gamer geek, kinky lesbian IT chick (has your brain exploded yet?)
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    • #3
      Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

      Agreed. I love the settings a lot but absolutely hate the rules. Back when Palladium started their rules were fairly innovative at the time, compared to their main competitor, TSR. However, unlike D&D, they stubbornly refused to acknowledge that their rules weren't perfect and needed an overhaul. Sad.

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      • #4
        Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

        They did some revisions over the years. Heroes Unlimited had a true second edition released. Rifts even eventually got an "Ultimate Edition" back in 2005 where they wrapped up a lot of the rules FAQs, clarifications, and small changes from other books over the years into a new version of the core book, although by that time I had pretty much quit playing with their mechanics anyway.

        Anymore I either play with friends using D&D/Pathfinder rules or if I'm GMing, I tend to just use the M&M mechanics for all my games, even fantasy/sci-fi anymore with just a few optional house rules here and there if I am adapting the flavor some towards a specific genre.
        Last edited by digitalangel; 19th July 2018, 11:13 AM.
        Classic car restoring, gun owning, martial arts practicing, military, gamer geek, kinky lesbian IT chick (has your brain exploded yet?)
        [URL="http://roninarmy.com/threads/1835-Digital-s-Daemons"]My character library[/URL]

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        • #5
          Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

          Cool, just thought M&M 3rd would be a good fit for Nightbane, just need to figure out the power scale. If you were to convert it what power level would you start characters at? 10 seems too high for the setting, I think.

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          • #6
            Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

            Don't see why 10 would be overpowered, since you're basically creating a monstrous super-being in Nightbane. I suppose you could start a campaign at PL 8 or 9, to emphasize the Horror aspect of the setting, and evolve things to PL 10 or even 12 as the campaign advances, with your PCs going from "barely surviving" to "powers in the Underworld."

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            • #7
              Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

              Maybe so. For some reason I thought they weren't quite as powerful as a full fledged hero, putting them closer to the Hero High power level. Not sure exactly why.

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              • #8
                Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

                Originally posted by shadryx View Post
                Has anyone statted up Palladiums's Nightbane/Nightspawn game? It should be easy to do, but I didn't want to reinvent the wheel if someone else had already done the math. Main question would be what level they would be. After that it would just be writing up the powers, I think.
                If your statting the powers, just use something like the number of dice=ranks in a power (i.e. a fireblast Palladium power doing 8d6 damage should be a rank 8 Blast).

                I would suggest trying to stat powers and abilities and not worry overmuch about converting level to power level. Especially if you are using them as NPCs rather than an a PC archetype.

                Just a couple of thoughts regarding Palladium to M&M:

                Relevant stats minus 10 then divide by 2 = stat numbers
                Approximate skills % divided by 5 = ranks

                That's all for now.

                I will be working some Palladium material into one of groups when I run M&M for them next, but that will probably be at least a year from now so I haven't done any serious design work yet.
                Say goodbye to gravity
                Say goodbye to death
                Say hello to eternity
                And live for every breath
                -The Wicker Man, Iron Maiden

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                • #9
                  Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

                  Well, it turns out I'm running M&M much sooner than expected, so I needed to hammer out my conversion process for Palladium a bit early.

                  These notes are designed with a focus on Heroes Unlimited, but I see no reason these might not be helpful with a Nightbane conversion.

                  Palladium to M&M 3e conversion

                  STR = PS -10, 2 (round down)
                  STA = PE -10, 2 (round down)
                  AGL = PP -10, 2 (round down)
                  DEX = PP -10, 2 (round down)
                  FGT = character level as base stat; +1 HtH: Expert, +2 HtH: Martial Arts, +3 HtH: Assassin
                  INT = IQ -10, 2 (round down)
                  AWE = ME -10, 2 (round down)
                  PRE = PB -10, 2 (round down)

                  MA in Palladium -10, 2 (round down) = ranks in Perception
                  *if calculation is a negative number, ignore

                  Palladium characters with a Spd of higher than 20: each 10 points rates a point of Speed (i.e. Spd 21-30 Speed 1, 31-40 Speed 2, etc.)
                  *Ignore Spd stat if Palladium character has a speed effect super power

                  Palladium non-physical skills should have the percentages divided by 15 to determine approximate ranks of M&M skills (Attribute and other modifiers added as normal). Physical skills should be approximated by Advantages.

                  Special abilities/features of the Palladium power categories should be expressed with the appropriate/similar Advantages, Powers and/or skills in M&M.

                  Palladium characters bonuses to strike, parry and dodge from their respective HtH levels should be added values to the M&M Attack, Dodge, and Parry traits.

                  Power conversion should strive to be faithful to the source material.
                  Examples:
                  AR 2 (round down) = ranks in Impervious
                  Dice of damage/effect = ranks of effect
                  Convert speed or distance values to closest value on M&M measurements table
                  Last edited by K.G. Carlson; 13th August 2018, 06:22 PM.
                  Say goodbye to gravity
                  Say goodbye to death
                  Say hello to eternity
                  And live for every breath
                  -The Wicker Man, Iron Maiden

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

                    After formulating my conversion ideas, I took them for a test drive. When applied to Power Master, a villain from the Heroes Unlimited 1st edition book, here's what I got:

                    Power Master - PL 13

                    Strength 7, Stamina 7, Agility 0, Dexterity 0, Fighting 4, Intellect -1, Awareness 0, Presence 0

                    Advantages
                    All-out Attack, Chokehold, Defensive Attack, Fast Grab, Improved Critical: Unarmed, Improved Grab, Power Attack, Takedown

                    Skills
                    Close Combat: Unarmed 1 (+5), Expertise: Auto Mechanic 4 (+3), Ranged Combat: Light Control: Damage 8 1 (+1), Technology 3 (+2), Vehicles 5 (+5)

                    Powers
                    Bend Light: Deflect 8 (light, mutant; Limited: Light based attacks only)
                    Blank Spot: Concealment 4 (All Visual Senses; Noticeable: "ripple" effect in the air Perception DC 15)
                    Energy Resistance: Immunity 10 (biological, mutant, Common Descriptor: Energy; Limited - Half Effect)
                    Enhanced Senses: Senses 3 (mutant, sensory, Extended: Visual 1: x10, Infravision, Ultravision)
                    Light Control: Damage 8 (light, mutant, DC 23; Increased Range: ranged)
                    Lightning Flash: Cumulative Perception Area Affliction 8 (light, mutant, 1st degree: Impaired, 2nd degree: Disabled, 3rd degree: Unaware, DC 18; Alternate Resistance (Dodge), Perception Area: DC 18 - Vision, Cumulative; Limited: Vision)
                    Protection: Protection 9 (biological, mutant, +9 Toughness)

                    Offense
                    Initiative +0
                    Grab, +4 (DC Spec 17)
                    Light Control: Damage 8, +1 (DC 23)
                    Lightning Flash: Cumulative Perception Area Affliction 8 (DC Dog/Fort/Will 18)
                    Throw, +0 (DC 22)
                    Unarmed, +5 (DC 22)

                    Complications
                    Arrogant: Totally self-centered and self-important. And when you're better than everyone else, why not?
                    Temper: The self you're lacking is self-control

                    Languages
                    American English

                    Defense
                    Dodge 6, Parry 10, Fortitude 7, Toughness 16, Will 0

                    Power Points
                    Abilities 34 + Powers 60 + Advantages 8 + Skills 7 (14 ranks) + Defenses 12 = 121

                    Notes:

                    Where physical skills or HtH levels gave bonuses to strike, parry or dodge, I ported those directly to the stats. Since strike bonuses are low in Palladium, I added the +1 to strike to both the specific close and ranged attacks. For consideration: should this bonus be added as ranks of the Close and Ranged Advantages instead, or kept to specific attacks.

                    I didn't like that a villain called Power Master should only have a STA and Toughness of +1 just because of a low PE, so I copied his STR modifier over to STA. Also, for Palladium conversions that don't have a high PE or a power that translates to STA, I divided the character's SDC score by 10 (rounded down) and made that ranks in Protection. That gave Power Master a Toughness of +16, much more appropriate I think.

                    Energy Expulsion: Light and Energy Expulsion: Energy seemed redundant in M&M, and at rank 4 (since it was 2D6 +1D6 per level) would not provide much danger for PL 10 heroes, so I lumped them together for a rank 8 Light Control.

                    Although not a perfect set-up, I feel the first trial run of the conversion process went well. Any thoughts or suggestions? Thanks!
                    Say goodbye to gravity
                    Say goodbye to death
                    Say hello to eternity
                    And live for every breath
                    -The Wicker Man, Iron Maiden

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

                      Tried to post this a while back, but the site blocked me for several days for some reason or my ISP blocked the site, whatever.


                      Originally posted by K.G. Carlson View Post
                      If your statting the powers, just use something like the number of dice=ranks in a power (i.e. a fireblast Palladium power doing 8d6 damage should be a rank 8 Blast).

                      I would suggest trying to stat powers and abilities and not worry overmuch about converting level to power level. Especially if you are using them as NPCs rather than an a PC archetype.
                      Agreed, that's definitely the easiest way. You also need to account for Palladium using about every size dice out there. Generally I subtract a rank if the converted item is Xd4 or add a rank or 2 if it is Xd8/10/12.

                      The most consistent way is a little more work in calculate the average result from a roll 3d6 for example has an average of 12 (11.5, but rounded off) so taking that average and dividing by about 4 will give you very close to using xd6 = 6 ranks, but will be most consistent when converting a something not based on Xd6 for the original roll you are converting into M&M.

                      Just a couple of thoughts regarding Palladium to M&M:

                      Relevant stats minus 10 then divide by 2 = stat numbers
                      Approximate skills % divided by 5 = ranks
                      Yeah, I used to love the Palladium skill system, except that it is very open to the GM having to add modifiers to your % target based on how hard or easy the actual task is. M&M (and D20 systems in general) have a better defined guide on what the target DC for a skill check should be. Basically think of the level of difficulty you think that character should have a 50/50 shot at success/failure and



                      Also remember on calculating stats that M&M uses an exponential increase in values, while Palladium's is much more linear. Remember that 12 is considered average human stat in Palladium, not 10. That would effectively lower all of Task Master's stats by 1.
                      Classic car restoring, gun owning, martial arts practicing, military, gamer geek, kinky lesbian IT chick (has your brain exploded yet?)
                      [URL="http://roninarmy.com/threads/1835-Digital-s-Daemons"]My character library[/URL]

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                      • #12
                        Re: Palladium's Nightbane/Nightspawn game?

                        Thanks for the feedback, digitalangel!

                        The villains in the back of the Heroes Unlimited 1e corebook are a little low powered even by HU standards. The NPCs in Villains Unlimited and later books have a more solid build and make better conversions to M&M.
                        Say goodbye to gravity
                        Say goodbye to death
                        Say hello to eternity
                        And live for every breath
                        -The Wicker Man, Iron Maiden

                        Comment

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