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  • Multiattack + takedown?

    Suppose I have an attack - let's say it's a melee attack with rank 8 and it has multiattack and my hero also has takedown.
    So using multiattack I attack 8 minions (at -8 to attack).
    Let's say, for the sake of argument, that since I am at -8, I only hit 2 of them. But they are minions, they are both incapacitated.

    Now... Takedown allows me a free attack any time I incapacitate a minion, and I just incapacitated 2. So does that mean I get 2 more attacks in which I could use multiattack and attack 8 more minions each?

    If so, I could wipe out an army in a single round.

    Or do I only get one more attack, even though I incapacitated 2 minions? Even in that case, I could still keep going and basically wipe out an army.

    On top of that, I understand that you don't even have to roll to hit a minion, you can just make it a routine check, so that means even at -8, I could probably hit ALL 8.

    Of course, there couldn't possibly be that many minions within range, so I would want to get Takedown 2 and Move-By-Action, right?

    This can't be right. What am I missing here?

  • #2
    Re: Multiattack + takedown?

    It's not "just get a free attack", it's "get a free attack against a minion". Keyword: A minion. Not multiple minions, just a minion.

    Even then, what would honestly be the better option is to just use takedown 2 to attack them one by one if you can hit them on routine anyway, then use Multiattack's single target feature to boost your damage by however much you exceed their active defenses, +2 for two degrees, +5 for three I believe. Although I'm not sure that's how Multiattack's single target works with takedown, but I mean as long as they're separate attacks, each against one target. It's more sane than say, multiple attacks against over 8 different enemies because you took down one.
    Last edited by ArmoredAnathema; 28th April 2017, 05:51 PM.

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    • #3
      Re: Multiattack + takedown?

      If you were doing it that way, I would argue that you get to attack one more minion for each one subdued, and each one subdued there allows for one more. I would not allow you to add to it.

      And honestly, I'd probably rule out combining Multiattack and Takedown in this case, much like I'd do with Area attacks.
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      • #4
        Re: Multiattack + takedown?

        You put one minion, you get to attack another. And if you put HIM (or her, let's be fair) down, you can do it again. And again. And again.

        That's what Takedown 1 gives you. Takedown 2, allows you to do your full move and attack at any point along the way. So your speedster can run around the room playing pinball with people. Right down to making the tilt sound.

        At that point, Multi-atack is really redundant.
        Last edited by Chris Brady; 28th April 2017, 08:07 PM.

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        • #5
          Re: Multiattack + takedown?

          The problem is there are several ways to take down multiple targets, which is good, but none of them work well in combination and there's nothing in the book that points this out.

          The 4 ways I know:

          Area - Extra that allows an Effect to hit all targets in a defined area. Targets get a Dodge Check for a potential half-rank save, and then a Resist Check. PL Limited.

          Multiattack - Extra that has a multiple target mode that hits several targets in an "arc" with an Attack Check for each target minus a penalty for the number of targets. The arc is not elaborated on, so it's presumed that not hitting allies and innocents in the arc requires Selective, much as you would for Area.

          Split - Flat Extra that allows a single Attack Check versus 2 or more (Split rank +1) targets, dividing the Effect rank between them.

          Takedown - Advantage that awards an additional attack as a Free Action on another viable target as long as all targets are minions. Incapacitating the target minion is the specific condition, so it could be considered for Damage or for Afflictions with Incap as 3rd Degree. This Advantage is ported over from other d20 games, though, so it's not clear whether it should work with Afflictions at all, or conversely work with any attack that inflicts maximum effect; GM's call, YMMV.


          Any one of these traits make for good "goonsweeping" - taking out large groups of opponents that are usually lower level than the PCs and most of their villains - and it's very easy for a single character to have any or all of them. In practice, though, it's problematic to use any of them in combination. Area doesn't use Attack checks, so it's mechanically impossible to mix with the others. Multiattack is ostensibly considered to be several attacks with a single Action, as is Split, but MA has the arc problem and Split does not.

          To address the OP, if you did combine MA + TD, a strict reading is that you would have to stop using TD as soon as you miss, so even if you got 7 out of 8, that last miss would break your streak. Is it possible to wipe out hundreds of goons using this ruling and routine attacks? Yes it is. Should a GM be aware of this and either make sure his goons are occasionally hard enough to take it, or possibly disallow this combo? Absolutely.
          My old [URL="http://www.atomicthinktank.com/viewtopic.php?p=743877#p743877"]Atomic Think Tank[/URL] thread
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          • #6
            Re: Multiattack + takedown?

            This topic was brought up at the RPG Stack Exchange.
            [url=http://roninarmy.com/threads/996]My Builds[/url]

            [b]Current games:[/b]
            [url=http://www.echoesofthemultiverse.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=839]The J.V. Team (GM)[/URL]

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