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Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

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  • Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

    For a game here on the forums I want to design a power for my character that works extra well on objects. The idea is that the military genetically desgined him to break open fortified buildings, or take out tanks, that sort of thing. No sneaking in, strictly powerhousing through the structure.
    So the idea's no problem, but when it comes to statting it out, I get stuck on stuff like an Improved Critical or Power Attack limited to objects. Because, of course, I do want to hit all the PL-caps for regular combat as well...
    Can anyone help me get better or more creative designs for this idea? I've been thinking it over and over and over, but...just got stuck I guess.
    [b][size=3][url=http://roninarmy.com/threads/4415-jacklang-Heroes-amp-Villains]My builds[/url][/b][/size]

    -----

    [i][b]Tom Joad:[/b] Well, maybe it's like Casy says. A fellow ain't got a soul of his own, just little piece of a big soul, the one big soul that belongs to everybody, then ... I'll be all around in the dark - I'll be everywhere. Wherever you can look - wherever there's a fight, so hungry people can eat, I'll be there. Wherever there's a cop beatin' up a guy, I'll be there. I'll be in the way guys yell when they're mad.

    - 'The Grapes of Wrath', John Steinbeck[/i]

  • #2
    Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

    Weaken Toughness (Affects Objects Only) would subtract its ranks from the Toughness of any object and it wouldn't be able to resist much after. 1pp/rank for close range.

    If you had 10 ranks anything Toughness 5 or less would instantly disintegrate.
    Penny's Build Party - Playable builds - M&M 2.5 featuring Damage Roll combat

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    • #3
      Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

      If you wanted to get kinda crazy, you could do some form of Permeate or Burrowing with Affects Others.

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      • #4
        Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

        Originally posted by badpenny View Post
        Weaken Toughness (Affects Objects Only) would subtract its ranks from the Toughness of any object and it wouldn't be able to resist much after. 1pp/rank for close range.

        If you had 10 ranks anything Toughness 5 or less would instantly disintegrate.
        Right! That's what I was looking for... Thank you!

        Originally posted by Unbeliever View Post
        If you wanted to get kinda crazy, you could do some form of Permeate or Burrowing with Affects Others.
        I like your out of the box thinking. For now, I'm good with the Weaken, but if he ever develops this power further I'll remember this
        [b][size=3][url=http://roninarmy.com/threads/4415-jacklang-Heroes-amp-Villains]My builds[/url][/b][/size]

        -----

        [i][b]Tom Joad:[/b] Well, maybe it's like Casy says. A fellow ain't got a soul of his own, just little piece of a big soul, the one big soul that belongs to everybody, then ... I'll be all around in the dark - I'll be everywhere. Wherever you can look - wherever there's a fight, so hungry people can eat, I'll be there. Wherever there's a cop beatin' up a guy, I'll be there. I'll be in the way guys yell when they're mad.

        - 'The Grapes of Wrath', John Steinbeck[/i]

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        • #5
          Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

          Transform to transform a broad group of targets (structures) into a single result (Wreckage).

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          • #6
            Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

            Transform has a heavy cost, though. Getting enough ranks of it to affect a typical building is beyond the budgets of most characters. Some people have suggested Damage, Alternate Resistance [Fort], Affects Objects, taking advantage of the rule where objects automatically fail at the maximum degree vs Affects Objects powers, however few GMs are likely to approve that. I'd use Weaken Toughness, Affects Only Objects myself as the most affordable method that still respects the spirit of the rules.

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            • #7
              Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

              Weaken Toughness (Affects Only Objects) linked to Damage, especially if paired with a lot of Inaccurate Flaw Modifier ranks will really ramp up the damage done to objects... And it's not like hardened bunkers have high Dodge Defenses!

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              • #8
                Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                Originally posted by Batgirl III View Post
                Weaken Toughness (Affects Only Objects) linked to Damage, especially if paired with a lot of Inaccurate Flaw Modifier ranks will really ramp up the damage done to objects... And it's not like hardened bunkers have high Dodge Defenses!
                Alternate effect: Dodge, Parry, or Fortitude. (Limited to Objects)

                Instant destruction

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                • #9
                  Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                  Originally posted by Tommiec21 View Post
                  Alternate effect: Dodge, Parry, or Fortitude. (Limited to Objects)

                  Instant destruction
                  You can't limit it to objects since they don't have any of those qualities in the first place. Objects only have Toughness. If you want to apply a Fortitude effect to it, you have to take Affects Objects [Only]--whether you want it to affect characters and objects (or objects only) is up to you paying for it.

                  The same goes for Alternate Resistance: Parry/Dodge. You can't choose that option at all when it comes to objects--they simply don't interact with it.

                  It's up to the GM as to what happens when an effect based on Fort/Will hits an object, e.g. a wall. Does it go through it, dissipate, etc? GM's call. On the old 2e ORQ, Steve said it bypassed cover, but I've known many a GM who balked at that.
                  Penny's Build Party - Playable builds - M&M 2.5 featuring Damage Roll combat

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                  • #10
                    Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                    Originally posted by badpenny View Post
                    You can't limit it to objects since they don't have any of those qualities in the first place. Objects only have Toughness. If you want to apply a Fortitude effect to it, you have to take Affects Objects [Only]--whether you want it to affect characters and objects (or objects only) is up to you paying for it.

                    The same goes for Alternate Resistance: Parry/Dodge. You can't choose that option at all when it comes to objects--they simply don't interact with it.

                    It's up to the GM as to what happens when an effect based on Fort/Will hits an object, e.g. a wall. Does it go through it, dissipate, etc? GM's call. On the old 2e ORQ, Steve said it bypassed cover, but I've known many a GM who balked at that.
                    But....You can.

                    I get what your saying about the Affects objects(Only) that was my mistake.

                    BUT you can definitely target Dodge, Parry, Fortitude, or Will when dealing with objects. When your hacking a Computer you target the computers Will, which it doesn't have so it auto loses (Unless its a Super computer with a defense score), You can target an objects Dodge or Parry since they are lacking a Fighting or Agility Score, and for that matter a Stamina Score, it acts the exact same way as any other damaging effect.

                    If you have a super power that Vibrates something until Liquefaction and its not meant to do direct toughness damage but instead fortitude damage due to Alt Resistance, your not gonna tell me that. "Oh, Well since it's a wall it can't vibrate and therefore resists your effect". No that wall is gonna crumble under the destructive force of my Vibration Power....

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                    • #11
                      Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                      Which is why I don't like making objects lack fortitude (or be immune) or stamina. (The concept of stamina being for living creatures only is a holdover from d20 days, and in the descriptive/effects based system that m&m is, is simply not needs.) That should be the realm of creatures things with literally no physical body like a thought, or classic ghosts.
                      Last edited by Nelphine; 13th June 2016, 10:25 AM.
                      Ragtop, Autobot! And Zeanthara, Are You a God?
                      Fenix, in the Merge, and Alicia DeVries, in the Cosmic Merge
                      Supe of the Justice League Academy

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                      • #12
                        Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                        Originally posted by Tommiec21 View Post
                        But....You can.

                        I get what your saying about the Affects objects(Only) that was my mistake.

                        BUT you can definitely target Dodge, Parry, Fortitude, or Will when dealing with objects. When your hacking a Computer you target the computers Will, which it doesn't have so it auto loses (Unless its a Super computer with a defense score), You can target an objects Dodge or Parry since they are lacking a Fighting or Agility Score, and for that matter a Stamina Score, it acts the exact same way as any other damaging effect.

                        If you have a super power that Vibrates something until Liquefaction and its not meant to do direct toughness damage but instead fortitude damage due to Alt Resistance, your not gonna tell me that. "Oh, Well since it's a wall it can't vibrate and therefore resists your effect". No that wall is gonna crumble under the destructive force of my Vibration Power....
                        I totally disagree. Your mental blast (Will Damage) has no effect on the wall. Your poison spit (Fortitude Damage) has no effect on the wall. Your Corrosive Spit (Weaken Toughness Affects Objects + Damage) does.
                        Penny's Build Party - Playable builds - M&M 2.5 featuring Damage Roll combat

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                        • #13
                          Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                          Originally posted by badpenny View Post
                          I totally disagree. Your mental blast (Will Damage) has no effect on the wall. Your poison spit (Fortitude Damage) has no effect on the wall. Your Corrosive Spit (Weaken Toughness Affects Objects + Damage) does.
                          but those are descriptor based Then, You as the GM have every right to inherently make Psychic powers not affect walls and such.

                          But My Vibration powers WILL affect the wall,
                          My Fire Powers Will affect the wall
                          My Freezing powers will Affect the wall.

                          And they can all target fortitude in one way or another.

                          Vibrating the Molecules until they fall apart.
                          Heating up the wall until it Melts
                          Freezing the wall until it becomes Brittle like glass then watch it shatter

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                          • #14
                            Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                            Exactly. Descriptors determine what hurts a wall - save type should not.

                            Vibration attacks make sense to hurt a wall. Poison attacks do not. Generally, walls should have Immunity: Life Support, and generally, they don't need anything beyond that. Most other descriptors ought to affect a wall, whether they target fortitude, or will, or toughness.
                            Ragtop, Autobot! And Zeanthara, Are You a God?
                            Fenix, in the Merge, and Alicia DeVries, in the Cosmic Merge
                            Supe of the Justice League Academy

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                            • #15
                              Re: Clever ideas for destroying buildings?

                              Originally posted by Tommiec21 View Post
                              but those are descriptor based Then, You as the GM have every right to inherently make Psychic powers not affect walls and such.

                              But My Vibration powers WILL affect the wall,
                              My Fire Powers Will affect the wall
                              My Freezing powers will Affect the wall.

                              And they can all target fortitude in one way or another.

                              Vibrating the Molecules until they fall apart.
                              Heating up the wall until it Melts
                              Freezing the wall until it becomes Brittle like glass then watch it shatter
                              You're going to have to show me where your Fortitude effect (without benefit of Affects Objects) is going to affect the wall. The Vibrating/Heating/Freezing descriptors are not what determines whether a given effect works against an Object. Please read the section on Damaging Objects and the description of the Affects Objects Extra before replying. Otherwise you're just saying that you get to because you want to, and I doubt too many GMs will agree with you.
                              Penny's Build Party - Playable builds - M&M 2.5 featuring Damage Roll combat

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