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  • JDRook
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    I like the Portal Extra as Concentration to simulate ongoing effort to maintain the portal. One thing that isn't addressed is the problem of mass. Default Teleport moves the user plus 50lbs (rank 0 mass) and presumably just works on discrete subjects (Others or Attack targets) plus rank 0 mass. This breaks down a little if you want the Teleportal to basically act as an escape tunnel for an arbitrarily large number of subjects (people, vehicles, livestock, etc). IMO there's basically two ways to handle this:

    1) Assume the Portal +2 Extra is Increased Duration (Concentration) for +1 and Increased Mass as a Full Extra so teleportable mass rank = Teleport rank. Usable by Others is also kinda squished in there.

    2) Ignore mass completely and assume the Portal can teleport anything that can fit in the portal. According to the Power Profile the base Teleportal is about 6' (rank -2 distance) which is easily suited for Medium sized characters, while Large characters might have to crawl or dive through and Large vehicles or even bigger characters may not be able to pass through at all. (GM call - after all, they might want some giant serpent to squeeze through and cause all kinds of mayhem.)

    I favour the latter since IMO it's narratively a lot easier to simply fudge sizes that to putter around figuring out mass limits.

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  • Nunya B
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    It's just Teleport with Portal and optionally Increased Duration, so the portals are Sustained instead of Concentration.
    Nothing fancy, but it confirms that Increased Duration and Portal play nice together.

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Interesting. Too bad I don't have access to it.
    How does it work?

    Leave a comment:


  • Bothrops
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Originally posted by Alderic78
    The more I think about extended portals, the more I think they're not compatible as options.

    Those increased durations require browsing he DC manual, the basic manual and the web don't have all the options for increasing duration.
    Oh, I think that Extended Portal is a perfectly acceptable power. The corebook is full of blind spots (inevitable, it's impossible to cover everything in a single book), so it's the GM's job to find a working solution.
    But if you really want hard & fast rules, you don't have to browse the DC manual: Find it on page 201 in the Power Profiles (the sampled "Teleportal" power).

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Originally posted by Bothrops View Post
    About Extended Portal Teleport; I'd use this solution:
    Round 1 - user creates portal (free action), maintains it (concentration: standard action), and then enters it (1st move action)
    Round 2 - user exits portal at the beginning of the turn (2nd move action); the portal then collapses, since the user is now dazed & has already used up his single action (so he can't maintain it)

    But yes, changing the portal effect to Sustained duration (Increased Duration extra) and/or adding the Easy extra would make it work much more smoothly.
    The more I think about extended portals, the more I think they're not compatible as options.

    Those increased durations require browsing he DC manual, the basic manual and the web don't have all the options for increasing duration.

    But our teleporting character is actually coming up well. So thanks for your help.

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  • Bothrops
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    About Extended Portal Teleport; I'd use this solution:
    Round 1 - user creates portal (free action), maintains it (concentration: standard action), and then enters it (1st move action)
    Round 2 - user exits portal at the beginning of the turn (2nd move action); the portal then collapses, since the user is now dazed & has already used up his single action (so he can't maintain it)

    But yes, changing the portal effect to Sustained duration (Increased Duration extra) and/or adding the Easy extra would make it work much more smoothly.

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    @Nunya I kinda like your Movement(Permeate) solution. I think it should go along with speed however, since it references moving at a slower speed with the first ranks.
    I've seen a lot of movement options with the limitation "while moving" (wall climbing and water walking) I'm thinking it could apply here as well, since you can't stop inside a solid object.
    However, unless there are some kind of extra limitations, it would end up costing as much if not more than a teleport over the same distance... so I'm not sure I could build a power like it as AE.

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  • Nunya B
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Another option for "Lots of short teleports" would be to build it as Flight or Jumping with Movement (Permeate) and the teleport descriptor. That would give you all the pros and cons of having to traverse space incrementally.

    > Bonus question how would you rate an attack form that always ends up lethal (of course for a hero character, a villain wouldn't care much) complication or an actual flaw ?
    If the attack is in an array with non-lethal capable attacks, not a flaw. See the above discussion RE "Limited: Men only, AE Limited: Women only". If you bought it "solo", I'd accept that as a flaw but it'd mean it wasn't a complication.
    And it'd likely only qualify as a complication when you really needed to attack somebody but all your other options weren't available. That'd be often if it was your only attack (maybe TOO often!) but not very common otherwise.
    Though if this is for an NPC, who cares! Point cost doesn't mean a thing, and it's a Complication for your PCs whenever it complicates their lives.

    > More questions: Teleport, with extended and portal... If I read portal correctly, you open a portal as a free action, need your move action to enter it, but also your standard action to concentrate on the power and keep it open... any way to make an extended portal ? Maybe with Extra Effort to get another standard action ?
    Three options I can think of, aside from Extra Effort.
    The first is to not concentrate on the round you open it and step through. It's debatable if this works Rules As Written, but it seems reasonable and I can't see it causing problems.
    The next is to buy up the duration from Concentration to Sustained, at an additional cost of 1 PP/rank. Then keeping the portal going is a free action, so problem solved.
    The last is to buy an Alternate Effect that's the exact same power without the Portal extra, and describe it as opening a portal and immediately stepping through and closing it.

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  • Rush
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Teleport is already a Move Action Effect, whether you use a portal or not (that's likely a convenient design choice.) Keeping the portal open after the first round is what the Standard Action is required for.

    I'd treat an Extended Portal similarly: you can create the portal for free, but for some narrative reason of your choice, getting to the other side (for you or anyone else) requires two Move Actions, and still leads to being Dazed and Vulnerable. Keeping it open on following rounds still requires a Standard Action.

    Edit: Hmm. Re-reading through the effect description, I think I was off on maintaining the portal. It's likely that if you want others to go through the portal at all, and not for it to collapse at the end of your turn, you need to use a Standard Action, even on the first turn. As far as how that would work with Extended portals, it's still ultimately up to the individual GM, but it seems reasonable and consistent to say that yes, keeping it open for a full round to allow others to pass through should require Extra Effort for the additional action.
    Last edited by Rush; 20th March 2018, 01:05 PM. Reason: See above

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Well, sure you need to roleplay it if you can't use your best (possibly only) attack against minions because they'll die from it and you don't want to leave a trail of corpses behind you.
    But since this is actually for an NPC, it's sooo much easier: No GM approval, no point cost, and the complication is for the players "Hey guys, your teleporting friend here just sliced a few civilians in two... I hope you have a first aid kit, and here is your Token" I might just do it ^_^

    More questions: Teleport, with extended and portal... If I read portal correctly, you open a portal as a free action, need your move action to enter it, but also your standard action to concentrate on the power and keep it open... any way to make an extended portal ? Maybe with Extra Effort to get another standard action ?

    Leave a comment:


  • FuzzyBoots
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Originally posted by Alderic78 View Post
    Bonus question how would you rate an attack form that always ends up lethal (of course for a hero character, a villain wouldn't care much) complication or an actual flaw ?
    (And I'm thinking of a bladelike ability for our friendly teleporter up there kinda cutting space which doesn't leave much space to "pulling punches") It's already modeled as a Damage at close range with a few extras such as subtle and reach, should eventually develop into a ranged ability, but we're not there yet.
    Within 2E, it was a 1 PP Drawback (a Quirk in 3E terms), but that was in part because every damage power, by default, got to choose between lethal and non-lethal damage, and it had tangible gameplay mechanics. Since lethality is more a roleplaying thing in 3E, I'd make it a Complication.

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    Guess the character will just blink around for fun when not doing something specifically called out by the rules such as Aoe Attacks, multiattacks and the basic turnabout teleport.
    It's much easier than trying to turn a teleport into a speed power that can bypass several obstacles including phasing through walls sticking to walls, but risking being seen and getting caught by something in the process...
    And a lot less of an headache...

    Bonus question how would you rate an attack form that always ends up lethal (of course for a hero character, a villain wouldn't care much) complication or an actual flaw ?
    (And I'm thinking of a bladelike ability for our friendly teleporter up there kinda cutting space which doesn't leave much space to "pulling punches") It's already modeled as a Damage at close range with a few extras such as subtle and reach, should eventually develop into a ranged ability, but we're not there yet.

    I know, I know... odd stuff... but I'm bored at work looking at installations progress bars

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  • pathfinderq1
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    I actually had a character that could do something like that, and I modeled it with a 1-point Feature, in addition to having the Turnabout extra, and Move-by Action. She didn't get any extra actions (without stunting) but it worked quite well to model things like 'blinking' around a target (for Agile Feint), and helped 'explain' her teleport-descriptor defenses (Enhanced Dodge/Parry, Evasion), when one knew that she could easily do a rapid series of 1-step teleports. It also fit very well with the manic/ trickster nature of the character.

    Depending on the GM, one could probably do this as Fluff- this is just what worked for my idea.
    Last edited by pathfinderq1; 20th March 2018, 07:10 AM.

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  • FuzzyBoots
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    I would handle it as a fluff descriptor as long as they're not doing anything in those distinct places, a Complication if they suffer ill effects for stopping there and doing nothing else, and Move-By Action if they're doing an action at each place (using Quickness or Multiattack or Takedown Attack, perhaps, to fit in multiple actions). So if someone's teleport descriptor is that they can cover a mile's distance in a Move action, but they do it in a discrete set of very brief teleports of 100 feet at a time, will wind up in the same place as they would before, but in the interim, they might get spotted, might set off some sort of proximity alarm, might wind up in hazardous territory, etc, much like someone using Speed to travel the same distance, but maybe avoiding some obstacles in between still.

    It gets trickier if someone wants to do things (plant sticky-bombs, drop flyers, shout advice to allies, open doors, etc) at each discrete teleport location. I think that's moving into the realm of needing Move-By-Action.

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  • Alderic78
    replied
    Re: Teleport questions

    I was also considering a way to model multiple teleports (in the same round) as a way of moving around.
    Say I have to cover 120' (I think that's the range of teleport 2) but instead of going directly fro here to there, the character blinks in and out (maybe 10-20 feet at a time) to get to the destinaton.
    Would this just be a fluff descriptor or there is a way to model it ?
    Yeah... I know...I have some odd ideas...

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