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Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

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  • Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

    Hi folks,

    I am planing to play Dragon's Hoard in a couple month and started preparing. This said, I do believe that it is essential for the whole campaign, that the first chapter "kicks arse"^^. Meaning of course, to make the heads of the players spinning, crying for more.

    My question is, has anyone any good ideas for "squat fights"? Squats are groups of ten. In warfare, in the open units are ok, rules are sufficent, i can live with that!


    I would like to further the excitement of the second scene, with a fight at the gates. The has been opened (i can manage that^^) but the garrison arrived on time to defend the breach (the open gate). Since I do not want to use warfere rules for that encounter, but also do NOT want to fight 10 vs. 10 using single combat rules (as suggested in the core book p. 176).

    I am looking for a set of rules (not too complicated) to fight for the gates, using a single roll for each group of ten fighter. I also would like either group to receive a bonus, when heroes (meaning exceptional personal, e.g.: player chars, sworn swords, master-at-arms, Ser Georg, etc.) join the fight. I would like to roll for either side in turns, killing each turn perhaps 1-3 of either group and pushing the looser of that round 0-2 yards back.

    The ideas I have been coming up yet, are:
    - use warfare stats for each group
    - when a heroe joins either side, this side gets +1D6 -1 for their attack and +1 to its combat defense, this multiplies for every heroe joining the struggle at the gate.
    - every heroe can still give warfare -2 orders to his the group of soldiers at the gates (minimum 1) (thinking about motivating for a take a breath acion to the whole group, e.g.)
    - for each one degree of success, a soldier gets incapacitated
    - for each 2 degrees of success:
    the battleline moves 1 yard (defenders got pushed 5 yards back, the enemies pour in; the attackers get 6 yards pushed back, the gate can be closed)
    the heroe takes 1 dmg (take a breath, fatigue, etc. applies for the heroes)
    - every other round just 1 soldiers can be replaces and any other round 2 soldiers and can join the ranks (so 3 soldiers in 2 rounds)
    - if more soldiers fall, than can be replaced, the number declines that fight side-by-side (any soldier less than 10 each side gives -1 attack, every 2 soldiers less, give also -1 comb. def.)

    But how can I make it agile (killing or wounding soldiers here or there) moving back and forth, threatening that the defenders at the gate could get pushed so far back, that the attackers can pour into the castle, so the home defending heroes must eventually join the fight. How can I kill/wound 0-3 soldiers on either side per round, but not killing my heroes too quickly? On the other hand, being able to push the attackers out of the gate, being able to close it again, etc.).
    I do not want to burn down the whole castle, but I want to make it a more personalized setting and fight, than just a warfare check, that doesn't fit the scene, in my opinion. I want the group to get in the midst, feeling desperate, getting emotionally involved.
    For the "non-combat" pc's will be sideplots, e.g. defending Aeron, fighting the much smaller numbers on the walls (cutting the ropes) healing chars, etc.!

    Are those corerules any good? Has anyone played Dragon's Hoard, how did you manage through the attack? How did it play out?

    I am thankful for any feedback
    sincerely Ignatz

  • #2
    Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

    Well, a very simple way to do this would be to take one character in each squad from both sides as the "main fighter" (usually the one with the highest Fighting score) and all the others are assisting that character, granting half their Fighting score (round down) as a bonus to the main fighter. So a main fighter with Fighting 5 and 3 bonus dice that gets help from another PC with Fighting 4 (Assist +2) and 8 garrison soldiers with Fighting 3 (Assist +1) would get 5D+3B+10 on his attack rolls.

    Also the Coordinate specialty of Will may become very useful in this situation, and allow non-fighter to participate in the battle.

    Once all bonuses are cumulated on each side, resolve the attacks and damage as a normal, with the whole squad targeting a single target each turn (usually a tertiary NPC, to make the generic soldiers fall first all around the PCs).

    As an option, have any superfluous damage after any tertiary character is defeated apply to another generic soldier in the squad. So if you attack a soldier with 9 Health and an AR of 3 and deal 18 damage, have the remaining 6 point of damage (18 - 3 AR - 9 Health = 6 damage remaining) be applied to the next soldier (who would received 6 damage, minus his armor rating of 3, so he would suffer 3 Health damage).

    When one soldier falls, you can have another take his place on the next round, as you stated.

    After the attack is resolved, compare the Fighting test result to the Passive Athletics (Strength) or Passive Fighting (Shields) of the main fighter from the other side (assisted once again by the Athletics/Fighting scores of its squadmates; +1 for ranks of 2-3, +2 for 4-5, etc. to his Passive Defense score). Each degree of success pushes back the squad by one yard. Of course, the opposing squad will attack on its turn, possibly mitigating this advance. At the end of the round, check if the squad is located 5 or 6 yards away from their starting position to determine if the enemies manage to pour in or if the defenders manage to close the gate...

    I think it would be simple to implement and not too rule-heavy to bog down the action as everything is resolved with a single roll on each side (or two if you use Coordinate)... What do you think?


    • #3
      Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]


      thanks mate. That is actually much more than I hoped for. I will do a couple "training exercises" and try to figure out the part about "the pushing back". Even the coordinate will work, even pretty significantly. I hope it will create a nice "back-and-forth-shuffle", at least for a little while, before one side makes significant progress.

      The rest I can figure out while "training".

      I am thrilled, thx again,

      sincerely Ignatz


      • #4
        Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

        When I ran this part of the scenario, I made a mix of everything.
        I stated the PC would finally push the attackers back and win the fight.
        To avoid a too long session - and because I agree on the fact the warfare rules doesn't fit to an attack of a castle - I used the warfare rules for the PC's garrison unit against the attackers who were climbing the wall and fighting in the courtyard.
        I used single combat rules for those PC who were trying to protect Aeron against 5 attacking ennemies.
        One PC was leading the cavalry. He stood behind the castle doors which were attacked by one ennemy unit and had to good idea to open the doors. Once that done, it was easy to charge the attaxcking unit who broke after one test.

        I was narrative for the whole battle and made the Azur Helms retreat without combat so they can represent a threat for the future.

        I had more problems with the intrigue part between the PC and Ser georg. it was clear they would never beat Ser Georg as none of the PC was a good schemer. So i made Aeron interfere and he proposed to share the Hoard with the Night Watch..which made Ser Georg give up the argument.
        Last edited by Tedric; 10th October 2018, 05:31 AM.


        • #5
          Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

          This isn't exactly in line with the title, but it's a Dragon's Hoard question - who has actually completed the adventure? I want to use the hallucinagenic mold (maremold) from the Valyrian tomb in an adventure I'm working on, but I can't find any stats for it? Did I miss something? Was it maybe part of the PDF (I bought the hard cover)? If you've played through the adventure, how did you handle that aspect?



          • #6
            Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

            Although I haven't run it yet, I did not see any stats for the maremold in the PDF eitherů I think it's more of a "plot device". It states that the Narrator should make the players roll Endurance without ever saying what if they succeed or not to make the atmosphere tense and suspensefulů I know its effect turns a Routine (6) Awareness (Notice) test into a Heroic (21) one, so we know at least what effect it can have (+15 to the difficulty of Awareness tests, caused by hallucinations), but for it's actual stats (virulence, toxicity, etc.), I guess it's up to the Narrator. We know it was a recreational drug used in Old Valyria, so I guess another relaxing effect similar to a pinch of sweetsleep may also be possible...


            • #7
              Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

              To be honest, the whole setting with the ancient tomb and traps and poison is not much to my liking. Sounds more like D&D or and Indiana Jones film, to be honest.
              Also I had my troubles bleiefing that Velaryon etc. brought their money TO THE STEPSTONES?! Beside the question why the hell there should be an old valyrian tomb there it is a little bit far away and certainly not the best area to hide a trasure (or specificly - to bring the treasure there with all the pirates etc. - and of course you want the whole thing back one day...


              • #8
                Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

                Thanks again, Zeroed . I hadn't caught that Awareness penalty, and I like your comparison to Sweetsleep - that definitely gives me some mechanics to play with. Maybe it damages Awareness, if Awareness reaches 0, they start hallucinating...


                • #9
                  Re: Rules for a squat fight at the gate Dragon's Hoard [some minor spoilers...]

                  By the way, I ran the Bethrothal tournament using Zeroed's rules for a squat fight to run the melee and it worked well.

                  I made slight changes to the rule : instead of inflicting all damage to 1 fighter, i divided them between three fighters chosen randomly.

                  I used Warfare/Tactics to determine Initiative and added the following options :

                  Flank attack : Warfate/Tactics vs Combat defense : Success : +1B to Fighting test.
                  Rear attack : Warfare /Tactics vs Combat Defense : Success : +1D to Fighting test
                  Charge : -1D to fighting; +2 to base damage.